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ESI coat of arms
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Val
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 Posted: Wed Sep 23rd, 2009 11:25 pm
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Dear Dr. Deb,
The ESI log has me fascinated these days. I am sure there are many relevant images and allusions on it, but I can't see it very well. the best image I can find is ESI logo Size 11 off your home page. The Inner Horseman issues I possess don't have a high resolution image. I've mouched around looking for a bigger or more "zoomable" image on the web, but no luck. Can you or your staff direct me to a good sized image?

I can see the horses and skulls are different, and the lamp of learning seems to be surrounded by a lead rope. How much of that is my imagination, I can't say but am looking forward to finding out. And what is that image opposite the yin/yang?

I cry you mercy, as the Lady of the Green Kirtle said. Anyone up for a look-over of the ESI logo?

Val

DrDeb
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 Posted: Wed Sep 23rd, 2009 11:57 pm
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Here you go. This has been asked before, but a new batch of Forum participants might enjoy finding all the "allusions" that are packed in there. Extra credit to anyone who can tell where I got the idea for the overall design. Cheers -- Dr. Deb

Attachment: ESI LOGO master color surround sm.jpg (Downloaded 211 times)

Val
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 01:03 pm
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Thank you! This will be fun and interesting. I know next to nothing about coats of arms, so this will be new ground, always a fun thing.

WHAT on earth is portrayed in the circle in the upper left corner, opposite the yin/yang?  Can anyone give me a hint?

Val

Blaze
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 01:19 pm
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Funny I was looking at it while the page was coming up and thinking I should ask. And Val already had!

I'm not sure If I'm going to express this correctly or not. It's circular - The upper right show's a flag to represent training, the bottom shows farrier tools and the upper right looks like dental tools.

I'm also puzzled as to what the circle is in the upper left.

Val mentioned the lamp is the lamp of learning? Then there's the yin yang circle which I believe represents balance.

I understand it that you need all of these things: knowledge, training, proper farrier, and dental to create a balance.

Are those bones just to the inside of the circles at the top?

It also looks like the Q in equine is a point larger than the rest of the letters. Is that intentional?

If I'm not mistaken, I believe you drew this Dr. Deb?

Erin

Val
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 02:33 pm
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Good eye, Erin, I did not identify the tools on the left as dental implements. 

A lamp illuminating a book is the crest.   A strong image in a strong position.  No need to over interpret that, it speaks for itself, but now what the heck is the dot-dash-dot circle surrounding the lamp itself representing?  it's not there for nothing. 

Yup, I saw the bones too, I'm going to see if I can identify them more exactly.  Femur? Not that I have any work to do today for my employer, or anything. 

And did you notice the two pillars supporting the crest, in addition to the two horses? And can you tell I've been reading about coats of arms, on my quest to earn the extra credit points? :-)

Val

Val
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 02:41 pm
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And I'd add inner life/outer life to the yin/yang symbol. 

KevinLnds
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 03:29 pm
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I think the dot-dash circle is a round pen with an open gate.

Kevin

Val
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 05:19 pm
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Now, I call that clever!

DrDeb
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 Posted: Thu Sep 24th, 2009 11:42 pm
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Yes, Kevin, that's what it's intended to represent: a roundpen with the gate open. Overlaid on the book of learning: in other words, you have to both read to gain knowledge AND you have to practice. And the way is open.

The yin-yang symbol does represent balance, but it's also a reference to Sally Swift's 'centered riding' approach. I give a nod to that school for being of real practical help to people who go to them and learn what they have to offer.

The tools in the upper lefthand corner are equine dental tools, and the strange-looking object in the circle overlaying them is a drawing of the chewing surface of a molar tooth from the upper jaw of a horse. The enamel pattern in horse teeth makes those complex-looking squiggly lines.

So, so far so good, and somebody also saw the pair of horse skulls and the anvil with the farriery tools. And the flag that someone noticed in the upper righthand corner is a reference to the Ray Hunt style of horsemanship. ...these are all the classes that I teach -- horsemanship and riding techniques, general anatomy, skeleton class, dental anatomy, anatomy for farriers. I also teach equine biomechanics, represented by the rearing horses. But those horses also represent something else -- something higher and deeper and better. So you might cogitate on what that might be.

There's also one more horsemanship tool in there that nobody seems to have noticed yet.

And I still want to know if anybody recognizes where the overall design for this logo actually came from.....in other words, the basic structure with the pillars and the shield and the rearing horses. It wasn't Hogwarts. Where was it??

Have fun -- Dr. Deb

Jean in Alaska
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 03:07 am
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I don't think anyone has mentioned the lead rope as a horsemanship tool, have they? I did guess it was a tooth, a molar, in the left hand circle. I recognized the dental tools, and anvil, etc.  And the flag.  Do the drapes or curtains have a meaning?  Do the curtains open into another world? Maybe the pillars come from some of the classical horse training pictures I have seen, working a horse between two pillars. Otherwise I don't know much about coats of arms.

Tammy 2
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 03:38 am
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I agree with Jean, something from the Spanish Haute Ecole Riding Hall ??  That's my guess.

Leigh in SoCal
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 04:22 am
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I'm going to cast a wide net of a guess:  the two pillars, shield and horses are of Freemason/Knights Templar origin. 

DrDeb
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 05:52 am
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Good ideas, people. The pillars do represent 'pillars', but not the pillars that are the posts you see horses being worked in cross-ties as for example by the Spanish Riding School; rather, the 'pillars of horsemanship'. I couldn't get four pillars in there, so they just have to be an allusion instead of literally four.

As to the draperies -- yes indeed, they are opening on another world.

And yes, you've got it -- there's a rope in there, which could be any and all of the following: a lead rope, a rope halter, a rope-nose bosal/cavesson, a lariat, or -- the Thread.

Really, if I ever re-do the logo, I'll have to find a place to put a Birdie in it too. You understand that the Institute was founded (and the logo drafted) in 1992 -- several years before I had any awareness of the Birdie.

As to guessing where the overall design came from: you're close. Go look at the frontspiece to William Cavendish/The Duke of Newcastle's "Nouvelle Method de Dresser une Cheval" -- everybody ought to make themselves familiar with the reprint of this work of the Classical High School anyway.

And while you're at it, turn over the leaves to look at the 'idealistic' plates at the rear of the book, especially the one in which Newcastle is drawn riding upon a horse with wings while being adored by a circle of trained horses. If you read French, try to translate the poem in the cartouche....highly allusive, romantic and idealistic. All fine horsemanship shares the same ideals.

Our logo as a whole I feel thus very well represents our motto: "Fostering Higher Education in Horsemanship." -- Dr. Deb

hurleycane
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 12:33 pm
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Is this the image?



 



 

 

Last edited on Fri Sep 25th, 2009 01:32 pm by hurleycane

Val
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 Posted: Fri Sep 25th, 2009 01:53 pm
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I did pick out the lead rope in my initial post, but I certainly did not make anything out of the molar!  This is very intriguing and fun.

The two horses: they are not rearing, they are deeply collected, in a state of inner and external balance.  do they represent the importance of internal ok'ness in order to achieve external release and poise?

Forgive my vocabulary, I'm having a menopause moment and I am forgetting the everyday names of things. Hopefully you can get my meaning.

Val


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