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lenadriver
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Posted: Sun Nov 1st, 2009 07:30 pm |
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Hi everyone, I am from Melbourne,Australia and I have noticed that every spring a large proportion of horses start having creaking or clicking joints. Age, breed, weight etc doesn't seem to matter. I see a lot of horses in my business and have noticed it for many years.
There are some who already creak a bit but get a lot worse in spring and there are others who only do it in spring.
I also notice that horses start to chew a bit of wood in spring too.
I assume this has something to do with nutrition, and the grass changing, but I don't know what!
The horses are healthy, well fed, wormed etc and come from all different areas and all have different backgrounds and have different health histories. The only common denominator is the season!
I have tried many joint supplements, 'multivitamins' and different feeds and 'cures' over the years and I have not yet found an answer nor any one who can give me an answer.
My own horses are all paddocked 24/7, have plenty of grazing and/ or get hard fed twice daily. I have even tried offering hay to those on grazing to stop the wood chewing.
I have owned horses for 30 years, rescued them for almost as long, work closely with my local equine vets and welfare agencies and teach other people how to look after their horses better, so in answer to all the obvious questions about their care, the answers will be yes.
If anyone can help here, it would be absolutely fabulous!
Cheers, Lena
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DrDeb
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Posted: Mon Nov 2nd, 2009 06:44 am |
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Lena, yes, you're right -- wood chewing often does have something to do with the animal trying to fill a nutritional deficiency. It may mean there is something "missing" in the diet.
In general, with domestic horses, we can say that what is missing in the diet is variety. However, we also have to ensure that we only feed things to horses that are good for them. To this end, since you are in Australia, you might want to obtain the Australian government publication by Melissa Offord -- it is a very readable spiral-bound book detailing all the noxious and poisonous plants -- some of those plants most definitely can affect bones and joints (i.e. as in 'big head disease' brought on by high-oxalate forages).
Then, you might also like to purchase a copy of "Poison Plants in the Pasture: A Horse Owner's Guide", which I wrote as a supplement to other good books on this subject already in existence, and as a basis for discussion of some of the important issues that face us today. In "Poison Plants" you will find not only bad plants listed but also a pretty complete list of all the types of grasses and forages that are normally fed to horses in Australia (as well as the U.S., U.K., New Zealand and Canada). Thus, from this book you can "learn your grasses and feeds" -- I myself was astonished at how ignorant I really was on this subject until I did the background reading and research. It was then my pleasure to compile what I had learned into this book for the benefit of my students. (BTW if you want to get PP on sale, go to the announcement thread at the top in the main Forum, scroll down to my second post, and click on the hotlink).
What I am saying is that we're not going to get to the bottom of this until you can first make a complete, accurate list of EVERYTHING your horses are being fed and EVERY PLANT that they could possibly be eating, either coming in with their hay or growing where they can stretch a neck out to grab it.
So that's first. Now there are three other usual causes for horses chewing wood besides an urge to fulfill a dietary deficiency. They are:
-- Mineral deficiency and/or imbalance, which can be related to grasses or forages that they are eating -- or may be more related to the type of soil you have or the type of soil they have wherever the hay the horse is fed is actually grown. To figure this out, ask around the people in your area who have cattle....do they have 'milk disease' or hypomagnesaemia? Do they need selenium shots in order to calve successfully? Are they being fed extra copper or boron? What mineral supplements are ranchers in your area feeding their beef and/or dairy herds? Do any nearby horse farms have horses with 'creaking joints' and/or have horses that think they are beavers?
-- The horse needs to be seen by a competent equine dental practitioner. Some horses will chew the furniture in an attempt to relieve pain or inflammation that is affecting the teeth, gums, cheeks, or tongue.
-- The horse is being kept for long periods in an utterly boring same old-same old, and/or has a desire to be with herdmates who are not present. The pasturage/paddock may be too small for the number of horses kept in it, creating stress and provoking the animals to seek relief by engaging in stereotypical behaviors such as wood-chewing or windsucking.
You'll have to think which, if any, of these situations may apply with your own herd at your own farm....let us know any thoughts or anything else you can say, and we'll go from there. As to creaking joints -- that may or may not be related -- we're going to have to take each factor separately. -- Dr. Deb
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lenadriver
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Posted: Fri Nov 6th, 2009 08:21 pm |
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Thanks Dr Deb,
I have just bought PP and of course your latest conformation/ biomechanics! I will source the other book you recommended.
All the horses have their teeth done as per my dentists recommendations, some yearly, others more often, and he is a qualified horse dentist.
I have had my property looked at by a horse pasture specialist but no soil analysis.
The main weeds I am fighting here are Pattersons Curse, but we hand spray almost weekly (ugh) and never let the grazing get so low that they start nibbling at it.
I definitely don't allow my horses to get bored. I have quite a few here with very high play drives and go to all extents to keep them entertained and using their brains as well as their bodies, even when in the paddock.
Our local area runs mainly sheep, with a few beef cattle, definitely not dairy country! However I have lived in many areas of our country and always noticed the same thing around spring and have clients reporting the wood chewing and creaking joints in Spring from all over the state as well.
I will pour through these books and get back to you. Thanks for your time, it is much appreciated.
Cheers, Lena
Oh, just for interests sake, I thought I would attach my latest rescue, he was delivered by truck on Wednesday, and went straight to Werribee Hospital. The wound so spectacular that even the chief vet took pics! These were taken moments after getting off the truck. WARNING- OPEN WOUND
Attachment: KIDS & BANDANA 31.10.09 021.jpg (Downloaded 128 times)
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DrDeb
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Posted: Fri Nov 6th, 2009 09:44 pm |
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Happily, Lena, though the wound is horrid and spectacular, it isn't going to do the horse much more than cosmetic harm. There are no muscles at all on a horse's forehead below the level of the eyebrows, so all he's done there is take all the skin off. It will eventually knit back over the bone.
Above the eyebrows the wound is more serious, as it appears to have chopped the medial parts of the temporalis muscles clean out. So infection there is likely to be more serious and it may result in some loss of the temporalis mass. However, much of it is still intact and unaffected so if the vet can dampen the infection and get the skin to knit over, he should be pretty much OK.
A wound to the temporalis will affect his chewing style, since the temporalis functions as one of the muscles that close the jaws, so he'll also need his teeth monitored -- but you would have done that anyway.
Keep us posted how it goes for him, and thanks for taking care of all the horses that you do. -- Dr. Deb
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lenadriver
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Posted: Sun Nov 8th, 2009 12:42 am |
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Hi Deb,
Just got back from visiting him in the hospital, he is doing really well. The wound is about half the size and they are gently stretching the skin back together as far as they can. He has really improved in himself, too.
They are re-dressing and re-stretching on Monday and whilst he is under sedation, they are going to do his teeth, I believe there was already a problem with one of his rear molars. Thanks for your support!
Cheers, Lena
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