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Improved poll for sitting position
 Moderated by: DrDeb  
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Poll
I would like to sit on my horse in position
   
   
   
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David Genadek
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 Posted: Sun Mar 16th, 2008 10:51 pm
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Here is a real picture to vote on.

Attachment: positions.jpg (Downloaded 1687 times)

christie
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 04:45 am
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I'm sort of confused by the question. I 'want' to sit wherever the best position for the horse is. Going by the video I took of me riding in your saddle on my horse today, I was in position B.

Helen
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 06:46 am
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Well then Christie, I think he's asking what position you think is best for the horse - in other words, if you had to design a saddle, where would you put the seat?

David Genadek
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 04:37 pm
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Christie,
    I am asking; Where do you want to sit? Once more people have had a chance to respond to the poll I will give an explanation of where I came up with the three positions. In the mean time try placing your saddle further forward and see what happens. Then place it further back and see what happens.
   I would expect this simple question to cause some confusion as there is much conflicting information out there. At the same time you have every right to sit where you want to sit and how you want to sit. The question then becomes would you sit where you are currently sitting if you fully understood the ramifications of your decision? 
   Remember the poll is anonymous.  Opinions can not be right or wrong as they are yours but they can be based on poor or mis information so what we will attempt to do here is gain some clarity by hearing different perspectives.
David Genadek

David Genadek
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 04:47 pm
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Helen wrote: Well then Christie, I think he's asking what position you think is best for the horse - in other words, if you had to design a saddle, where would you put the seat?
Helen,
     You bring up an excellent point here.  I never mentioned anything other than where you want to sit. You have have presented the position that you think the welfare of the horse should be the first and most importatant criteria. I agree but is that the perspective of those designing saddles?  Oh the plot thickens!!
David Genadek

ozgaitedhorses
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 09:00 pm
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David, I have to agree that your model looks a lot better than the skeleton I pinched from someone else's closet... ;-)

Is there a way to keep this topic at the top of the list - a sticky or something? Fancy soft ware like this should have an option....

This is going to be a very interesting one!
Looking forward to your view of the industry!
Cheers,
Manu

Helen
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 09:49 pm
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David, I understand - but if she wants to sit where is best for the horse, then your question 'Where do you want to sit?' extends to ask her where she thinks is best for the horse... because that's where she wants to sit.

David Genadek
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 10:52 pm
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Helen wrote: David, I understand - but if she wants to sit where is best for the horse, then your question 'Where do you want to sit?' extends to ask her where she thinks is best for the horse... because that's where she wants to sit.
In her case yes and I like her way of thinking. But what if some one wanted to sit in position C so he could whoop the horse in the ass. I wouldn't agree but it would still be where he wanted to sit.
One of the personal questions I am looking for an answer for here is; Am I working to design a saddle no one really wants? Thats why I'm interested in what people are thinking weather I agree with it or not.
David Genadek

David Genadek
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 Posted: Mon Mar 17th, 2008 10:55 pm
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ozgaitedhorses wrote: David, I have to agree that your model looks a lot better than the skeleton I pinched from someone else's closet... ;-)

Is there a way to keep this topic at the top of the list - a sticky or something? Fancy soft ware like this should have an option....

This is going to be a very interesting one!
Looking forward to your view of the industry!
Cheers,
Manu
Well I have kind of messed up and we have three threads going on the same thing maybe Jeff could combine them. Interesting how the A and Bs have reversed since we we got some flesh.
David Genadek

Cyrus44
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 Posted: Tue Mar 18th, 2008 01:08 am
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I will continue my ongoing saga of  saddles here.

AANY HELP IS SO NEEDED.. and thanks dave for the DVD on its way..  I guess I might be back to being saddleless..

I will ad the saddle I have ended up with last year, I took photos etc.

I worked with person who does NOT sell saddles, but a riding teacher to help me.

I believe the aim of the person trying to help me find a saddle was to

1. Make sure we  no longer crippled my poor appis shoulders.

2. make sure it cleared his withers and gave good clearance either side of his spine.

3. They insist, even tho he has a long looking back, its really short , so they were trying to avoid pressure on his last rib.

4. Accomodate me, a dressage saddle and I am a bigger rider- who is not really built to ride either, sitting on a 44 gal drum horse. hes VERY wide.

5. Find a tree that suited his back, which seemed to take a "sudden drop" after being left out for year and not being ridden, plus he just kept getting fatter and fatter.

6. make sure it had as even pressure front to back

7 Seat me in the middle of the saddle and try and keep me balanced. (old roundshouldered and NOT thin)

I tried a few saddles which I hated, not at all comfortable to me.

The costs become a very limiting factor, with the vet bills, etc etc.. different shoeing, feet xrays... $$$ are scarce, and I am also not working.

 

If I ride this horse bareback- I slide off all the sides, slip left, and and up back in position C myself. Its quite different to my other horse, he has a much higer wither, and I sit up near B and A in my saddle and bareback, and its easy to stay  put at walk trot and canter, in comparison.

 

This is the saddle I ended up with, some days it seems fine, other days it rubs under my right shoulder area, sort of scrubs his hair about.

 

PLEASE FEEL FREE TO COMMENT RE GOOD OR BAD PLEASE

Me and my horse- the lastest saddle I have



 

Without me- when it was first bought



he is a bit  thinner now-  but

 

This is how his back looks



Riding in the saddle- hes a lot happier now than he was then, but still not right.



 

Previous saddle- the one Dr Deb saw me riding in at her clinic- but he got so wide & dipped in his back,  it missed his back by 3cm.



 

Last edited on Tue Mar 18th, 2008 01:11 am by

David Genadek
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 Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 02:26 pm
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Jennefer,
"I worked with person who does NOT sell saddles, but a riding teacher to help me."

Selling saddles or not, is not an determiner of integrity and knowing how to teach rideing does not always translate to understanding saddle dynamics.

"This is the saddle I ended up with, some days it seems fine, other days it rubs under my right shoulder area, sort of scrubs his hair about."

Sounds like you need to read Lessons from Woody in the Knowledge base section.
David Genadek

Cyrus44
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 Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 07:58 pm
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I have read woody, I try my best to keep this horse straight ( at times I think my own crookedness, as I often have a sore back, makes this worse for him as well)

I do ride other horses and they do not apprear to have the same problems as this one.

Will woody help with physical issues, and if so reading woody did not really help me work out what is the best approach, presently I don't  really understand the exercises that would help my horse, apart from doing the ones Dr deb used in her clinic when I met her here. I was by no means a favourite student of hers.

But she felt my horse had paiffe and passage to offer, to me it was a pain response to something, and if it hurts too much hed rather help me off, in my opinion.

I still cant figure out what causes the pain( but it could be feet/ shoeing )  or if the new saddle makes it worse.

He has a much larger shoulder on the left than the right, and has been this way all his life.  The whole odd problems began about 2 years ago, and I would canter right, and when we would stop my saddle seemed to drop to left, as if his muscles collapsed.

It seems to be that the other ideas here suggest that finding a barefoot shoer, returning to barefoot, might help most.

 I have little choice so far, but to try peoples ideas,  and see what happens, as there are lot of people out there who think what they believe is always right.

I just know my horse is not right.

Last edited on Wed Mar 19th, 2008 08:07 pm by

David Genadek
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 Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 11:03 pm
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at times I think my own crookedness, as I often have a sore back, makes this worse for him as well)
   Ahh that does sound like the place to begin.  I have been dealing with some cronic pain issues myself and I can't tell you how very important it would be for you to get some help. Cronic pain has many very negative side effects. One of which is poor sleep which leads to a total break down of just about everything in your body.
David Genadek

David Genadek
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 Posted: Wed Mar 19th, 2008 11:34 pm
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I’m getting ready to call this election but before I do would anyone care to share their reason for why they choose the position they did.
For instance:
 I chose A because it makes sense to me that I would want to be close to the support of the front legs.
I chose B because it is obvious I need to be there to stay out of the way of the shoulder.
I choose C because it just makes sense that if I want the front end to be light I would not want my fat @#$% there.
David Genadek

Adrienne
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 Posted: Thu Mar 20th, 2008 12:09 am
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Hi David,

 I voted for A. I would think B would be best, simply because you would avoid either extreme (A or C). But I picked A because I grew up riding bareback and if you wanted to stay on and WITH the pony's/horse's movement A was by far the best place to be.

 Right now I ride with a western type saddle(it was the only saddle I could find that fit him) that puts me at "C", on a race bred Arab gelding. He has a very short back even for an Arab, is barrel shaped and is very leggy.
 So when riding him I just have this overwhelming urge to sit at A and shorten my stirrups a bit and just "go", as he just loves to move out freely.

 I want a Mongolian saddle for him. I found an old book for sale online that is a step by step guide on how to make your own Mongolian saddle and I'm hoping to order it and give it a try. The saddle type seems to be designed to place the rider near A or at A depending on the horse/saddle and from all I've read about the Mongolian people I think they should have worked out a saddle design that is good on the horse by now.
 I guess I'm saying I think you can design a saddle that would put you at A without interfering  with the horse's shoulders, like when riding bareback.

 So my reason summed up is; I think A is the best place to be to stay with the horse's movement and out of his way.

Last edited on Thu Mar 20th, 2008 12:10 am by Adrienne


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