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cdodgen
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Posted: Mon Mar 10th, 2008 07:16 pm |
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In Dr. Deb’s discussion of nosebands featured in the “Biting Series” she clearly pointed out the adverse effects that over-tightening a noseband can produce within the horse’s jaws which logically would also apply to the adjustments of a sidepull. Having never worked with a true sidepull I would like to have some feedback on what to look for in the structure of, materials made of and adjustments to be made to the sidepull.
Also I would like feedback on whether there are any advantages to starting a colt (4 yr old) long-line driving in a sidepull versus a snaffle. The one advantage that I can think of at this time is that I would have a greater chance of NOT causing any pain in his mouth as his “bridle/canine teeth” are not erupted and his jaw line still shows signs (bumps) that not all of his adult molars have fully erupted and set.
I have seen some sidepull designs that allow for the attachment of a bit and assume that the design thought is to condition the horse to packing a bit without actually causing the bit to come into use, unless of course, you really hauled on the reins.
Thanks in advance for any and all input.
Cheryl
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Pauline Moore
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Posted: Wed Mar 12th, 2008 12:46 am |
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Hello Cheryl - For what it's worth, thought you may be interested in what has worked well for my own 4-yr old, but others may have different views.
I couldn't find a sidepull bridle that fitted him to my liking (and didn't want to go to the expense of having something custom-made for a head that was still growing), the nosepieces were all too tight and I rejected the advice of the saddlemaker that the noseband should be as tight as possible. Neither did I like the texture of the rope nosepieces, they seemed too sharp and rough for a part of the body that is extremely sensitive - just as much as the mouth, if not more so (but at least there are no erupting teeth to worry about). In the end I resurrected an old leather drop-noseband, fitting it so that it sits halfway between where a dropped noseband and regular cavesson noseband would sit. It fits lightly around his jaw without restricting movement but not so loose that it could swivel and have the headstrap touch his eye. To this I attached some soft, knitted nylon reins, but did not bother with browband or throatlatch, it's just the noseband and reins, nothing else.
Years ago I used to do a lot of long-rein driving of youngsters, but more recently have abandoned that in favour of driving with short reins. I found that the long-reins made it harder to give clear signals to the horse, and more importantly, harder to give that instant release. The longer the rein, the greater the time delay in transmitting the release. Also, long reins are inevitably heavier and think that it may not be a good thing to have extra weight hanging from either noseband or bit, again makes a clear release harder to convey. The old noseband and soft short reins worked very well for my colt, he quickly grasped the idea of turning and stopping, and I think it has been an advantage to be so close to him while he is moving. He has got used to the feel of my arm resting on his withers or back the whole time, and the feel of my body brushing against his ribcage as we walk along. Another big advantage is that it is much easier to keep his attention from this position - I can see his focus starting to wander and do something about it before he's even taken a step.
Now that he understands this game, and has become very light in his responses, I have swopped the old noseband for a flexible braided rope version which I will use for riding. I don't think this would qualify as a bosal but it's a rope noseband that has been coated in some sort of resin-like material that gives it some stiffness and is also smooth. I can bend it to any shape and it will hold that shape without being rigid, so it sits on the colt's face but is barely touching his nose, the weight of it does not hang from the bridge of his nose. Again, it's just the nosepiece and headstrap to secure it. This also is working very well but I still think the old leather noseband was a better choice for the early stages when the colt didn't have a clue what I wanted from him.
Best wishes - Pauline
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DrDeb
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Posted: Thu Mar 13th, 2008 04:57 am |
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Pauline, as usual you are right on. You'll be amused to know that the old California vaqueros, in the days when California was a Mexican province, used to show off by exhibiting how soft and responsive their colts were by riding them in a "glad rag" or neck handkerchief. They just knotted the kerchief around the horse's face, tied the mecate (braided horse hair reins) to the scarf, and rode. I still like the scarf idea -- so soft to the sensitive skin of the face. I learned this story from Ray Hunt, but later confirmed it by examining old writings, paintings, and engravings from Mexico.
As to the original question: the sidepull is never adjusted tight like a dropped noseband. In fact, the biggest problem with the commercially-available sidepulls is that generally, they're too loose and sloppy -- they tend to ride around on the nose. So when I buy one of those, I always modify it by adding a leather chinstrap. Thread the chinstrap through the rings that are for the reins, or else some models have more than one set of rings and then you use the lower set. Snug up the chinstrap until the whole rope-and-leather circle going around the horse's nose will neither ride up nor crank over the nose circularly. If the nosepiece slops around, it will rub and can rub the hide right off.
The same goes for the commercially-manufactured "bosals": they aren't really bosals, most of them. Most have a cable core, and this is nothing you would ever want to put on any horse's head. The cable cores prevent the so-called "bosal" from being able to be shaped and fitted properly, or from holding a shape.
A real bosal is expensive because it is handmade entirely from leather and rawhide, or just from rawhide. To fit it, you get a can the same size as where you want it to go around on your horse's nose, and you wet the bosal thoroughly, shape it over the can, and then leave it somewhere it will dry out again slowly. This will cause it to conform to the horse's head as a man's straw Stetson would conform to the contour of his head.
Most important with the bosal, though, is to realize there's a certain shape to the side of a horse's cheeks and from there on down to the jawbone itself. The soft, sort of puffy cheek drops down to a flat, hard area that is formed by the side of the jawbone. What you absolutely want to avoid is that the bosal would rub the side or the sharp under-contour of the jawbone. Many of the pseudo-bosals do this so badly that you'll see people riding them with the soft rag wrapped around the lower part of the pseudo-bosal!
So Pauline built herself a good tool, and here's another one. I took an English jumping hackamore of the flat variety. Many of them have round nosebands, like a piece of rubber hose, but you can find them flat. The flat ones are made of a strip of rather firm foam which is covered with a smooth piece of leather that has been sewn over it snugly. The seams are on the edges where they do not touch the horse at all, so all you have with one of these is a smooth leather noseband that's shaped like an upside-down "U".
At the bottom of each leg of the "U" there is a ring, where the reins are supposed to attach. So once again, I took a leather chin-strap like you would have on a "western" bit and threaded it through the rings. Like Pauline's outfit, mine also has no browband and no other chinstrap. Once it's adjusted, it just fits loosely around the horse's nose without yet being "too" loose. In this rig I rode Painty for years, and am now using it on Ollie too -- it works just fine. I like to alternate rides in a bit, or actually a variety of bits, with rides in this noseband outfit.
If your horse tends to lean on the hand, ride him in a noseband in an arena or other fairly small, fenced enclosure, and use the noseband as your opportunity to teach him to respond to lighter stopping aids. If he does not stop at first, do not succumb to the temptation to pull back or even block "squarely" with both hands; doing so will only teach him to lean harder. Instead, if he does not respond promptly and lightly, BEND and stay bent until his feet stop (this is the famous "one rein stop"). Alternate sides on successive stops.
Pretty soon he'll get the message. Then your goal becomes to connect with his feet. When you do, you'll feel him prepare to stop before he actually stops.
After riding this way in the noseband, you'll find that your hands in the bit feel crude to you -- then that becomes another opportunity for you and your aids to further "disappear". Cheers -- Dr. Deb
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JackieF
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Posted: Mon Apr 21st, 2008 05:43 pm |
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Regarding the bosal fit:
I have been training and riding my horse in a shaped rawhide core bosal for about a year now. The bosal follows the contours of her nose & jaw. How much of a gap is recommended between the lower jaw bone and the mecate rein wrapped around the bosal? This gap determines how wide the horse can open its mouth. My gap is about 3 fingers now.
Thanks
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Andi Bartnek
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 09:40 pm |
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| I understand your frustration at trying to find a decent sidepull. After trying and rejecting rope nosed and other variations and finally making do with a lunging cavesson with reins attached, I finally saw one that Josh Nichol was using. After enough badgering from lots of his students, Josh, who Dr. Deb has mentioned in the forums before, has managed to get nice ones made locally - both English and Western styled. I've been riding in mine for 3-4 years now and most of the time if people see us in it, they don't even initially realize it isn't a "normal" bitted bridle - which then brings up some interesting conversations about "Isn't that an aged horse? Why are you riding him in a training bridle?" If I'm allowed to say, you can see them at josh's website: http://www.joshnichol.com If not, maybe you can contact me dirtectly and I will point you to the site where you can see them.
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Allen Pogue
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 03:47 am |
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Dr Deb,
Is there in your opinion a correct/acceptable way to use the traditional serretta?
I have several bought experimentally, two of Spanish origin, the other Portuguese. One has a flexible nose piece, the other two have the shaped metal covered in leather..I simply could not bring myself to strap any of them on as suggested by tradition, and covered them in thick wooly sheepskin.
Allen Pogue
Dripping Springs, Texas
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rachel
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 05:55 pm |
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| Allan, I have been lucky enough to find a well made cavesson in portugal without the serrata on the underside, and witnessed several different types with and without joins available without the serrated edge, so there are some around if that is what you are after instead of the serrated ones.
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Sam
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Posted: Wed Apr 30th, 2008 07:43 am |
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Hi Andi, Thanks for the link to Josh's site, great pics of the side pull can really see what one looks like now. Much appreciated. Regards Sam
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Ben Tyndall
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Posted: Wed Apr 30th, 2008 02:55 pm |
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| Now we just need a picture of a serretta (with serrated edges?). No doubt Dr Deb knows what a serretta is, but I hadn't heard of it until Alan's note.
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Leah
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Posted: Wed May 7th, 2008 07:17 pm |
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Can anyone assist me in finding a link to an english jumping hackamore that is flat and not round?
I have not had any luck.
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Leah
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 05:42 pm |
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I just had an A-HA and wanted to share in case anyone is having trouble finding these things or has a retired bitless bridle.
I have a Bitless Bridle that I don't use-it is the style where the reins cross under the jaw.
The beauty is, the nosband has a ring on each side, similar to the dropped noseband Pauline described.
I just realized I can remove the cross reins and then just use the noseband headstall and can attach reins to the rings on it and have the same setup!
Here is a link to a photo in case my description is unclear:
http://www.actionridertack.com/catalog/images/bitless-bridle_cook.jpg
Hopefully that may also help someone wanting to rotate between bitted and bitless!
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miriam
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 07:49 pm |
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Hi Leah,
This set up looks a lot like my 'soft hackamore'. I have a rope halter that has rings tied just where your rings are. Since it's a rope halter, I can use it for just that OR I can attach the slobberstraps/rein rig onto the rings, OR tie a mecate onto it (which is our current favorite). We love the mecate set up. it's so handy to jump off and use the mecate rope end for stuff on the ground if desired. And if you need to, you can always untie the whole mecate and then you've got a nice long rope. I've noticed that he can even eat grass with it on but it's about as snug as yours around the nose. Adding the extra knot with the mecate makes for quite a big knot, but he is very responsive to small movements of it.
Miriam
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DrDeb
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 08:24 pm |
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Leah, since you had already made the mistake of buying one of the particular bitless devices for which you provide the link, then I think modifying it so that it works properly is a good idea.
For anyone who has NOT already purchased this device -- don't. The problem with them is that the design does not permit instant release; it's a head-squeezer or head trap.
Spending money on it is also absolutely unnecessary, because if you're that unsure about how to twirl the head, you can make an instant-releasing cross-rein device yourself. Simply bit the horse in the usual snaffle and attach two sets of reins. Have the upper set uncrossed, and the lower set crossed. The upper set of reins is there to act as a safety device in case you or the horse gets mixed up. The lower set of reins will strongly pull on the head in the way it needs to be pulled on in order to obtain the head-twirling gesture -- the only difference being, it will twirl it "backwards", i.e. if you pull on the crossed right rein it will twirl the head to the left. I went through this stage of "inventiveness and inquiry" myself, long ago, and I wouldn't blame anybody else if they felt they needed to try this for a day or two as a stage in learning. If you don't want to use a bit, you can rig a sidepull similarly.
After a day or two, you can take the crossed rein off and you'll find you can twirl the head just fine with either a bit or sidepull or jumping hackamore.
As to the mecate, yes, I agree they're handy but don't expect twirling the head when the reins are attached anywhere below the horse's mouth to be easy. Below-the-mouth attachments, like shanked bits, are for riders who already know well how to twirl the head AND WHEN TO RELEASE so that the soft feel is not only obtained, but sticks around for a while without further requests or reminders. Also, to use a below-the-mouth attachment, the horse already must yield up a good bend through the RIBS as well as the neck and head, in response to the rider's body position alone, i.e. no hands needed. -- Dr. Deb
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Leah
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Posted: Thu May 15th, 2008 08:50 pm |
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Yes, Dr Deb, thank you for emphasizing the point-do not buy but retry if you own!
They have been hanging in my tack room for AGES and I kept them thinking I may use the parts for something one day.
And here we are.
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miriam
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Posted: Fri Jun 13th, 2008 10:44 pm |
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Might you talk a bit more about (problems with) the below the mouth attachment? This would include the bosal I'm thinking? Wouldn't we want to go for the feel that doesn't use the hands, and instead comes from the rider's center or core? Does the below the mouth attachment change the moment and timing of release?
Thanks, Miriam
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